Tuesday, March 03, 2009

"So much for astrology"....?

In a piece called "Old? Me? The Politics of Aging", screenwriter, playwright and lyricist Sherman Yellen wrote this a few days ago :

"Elizabeth Taylor and I share the same birth-date and birth year. She's been married seven, eight times and lived an extraordinary life, famous lovers, world-wide scandals, adventures, diamonds, Oscars. I've only been married once - most of my adventures were part of a splendid and tumultuous inner journey and I didn't make headlines or fortunes along the way. We share the same sign, the same chart, but oh, what a difference in our lives. So much for astrology."

It's a pity that, in all likelihood, readers of his otherwise excellent essay will store up that piece of information and use it in anti-astrology debates at some future date. It would be bad enough, if Mr Yellen's statement were true, but on searching I find, from information on his own website, he was born 25 February 1932, whereas Ms Taylor was born 27 February 1932. On top of that, the two were born an ocean apart, one on each side of the Atlantic. Two days, and no doubt several hours, and over 4000 miles is quite a big difference, astrologically and environmentally, just for starters.

Their natal charts are very similar, although minus rising sign and exact Moon position, both of which depend on exact time of birth - a whole lot of wiggle room remains. The two omissions are vitally important parts of any astrological chart.

There are millions, nay billions, of people being born on exactly the same date, same geographical location (or near enough) and leading totally different existences. That's life. Each individual uses his/her potential in millions and billions of different ways.

Suppose that Mr. Yellen's statement had been true, and he and Liz Tayor had been born on the same date, even in the same country and city: just because two or two thousand people are born with a certain blend of natural inclinations and characteristics doesn't set them on the same life path. Environment, education, family background, childhood experiences, genetic pre-disposition, health, accident, and all manner of other components are also part and parcel of the human condition. Astrology is only one strand of many in a tangled network.

"So much for astrology" ?

Plant two seeds out of the same packet in a patch of garden - one might grow tall, bloom well and long, seed plentifully, while the other, a few feet away, but in the shade of a large bush wouldn't fare as well, or may grow tall but fail to flower as profusely, or perhaps a neighbour's dog came along and dug up a few of its roots, or an infestation of ants spoiled its growth or.....a million and one things can happen to a seed, a plant and a person. What doesn't change though, is the inbuilt potential of a seed, or a person, to develop in certain ways.

The potential to be a loving partner to one, or eight, significant others, the wish to be part of a pair rather than solitary, the potential for artistry whether in acting or writing or painting. Without knowing either Elizabeth Taylor or Sherman Yellen intimately nobody can say how alike or unlike they are in nature. Their respective upbringing may well account for some very obvious differences in lifestyle. Possibly even more significant are the partners they have chosen, and natal charts of those partners. Those factors alone might cause paths of two people of similar inbuilt nature to diverge wildly.

Back to those important astrological differences which are present even when two are born on the same day. Exact time of birth is paramount. This piece of information would, unless both were born within the same few minutes, change things fairly dramatically chart-wise. Rising sign would be different for each, which means the way the world sees each of them and the way each sees the world would be quite different. Orientation of the angles would differ, perhaps putting certain planets in stronger positions in one or other chart. The position of the Moon is almost certainly going to be different in the two charts, and thus the potential for Moon making more or less aspects to other planets, bringing in yet more subtle, but clear differences in the two personalities

Mr. Yellen may or may not have been using a bit of journalistic licence when he stated that his birthdate and that of Liz Taylor were one and the same, but even if he genuinely believed they shared a birthday, his comment, "So much for astrology" was seriously misguided.


Anonymous said...

Very well said, Twi!

I have a pair of clients (cousins) delivered not only by the same doctor on the same day, but in the same hospital room--and I can attest to how important the difference in time and nurturing environment is to development--not to mention how the same aspect can take various forms in the life.

Thanks for an excellent article! jd

Wisewebwoman said...

I did know someone born on the same day as ET and he was as flamboyant and addictive as she. He wrote to her and they maintained a correspondence for years. I was fascinated by her letters, all written in violet ink and very gushy.
so much for HIS theory!!

Rossa said...

On a completely different topic what's your take on this idea?


I've only watched the first video. Picked it up from a UK blog that's anti-EU.

Apparently 20 States want to take back their sovereignty from the Federal Govt. as they claim the Fed Govt has breached the Constitution.

Over here that would have an impact on the EU....so we'll be watching!

Twilight said...

Julie - Hi! Glad it was of interest, and thank you for a supporting example, too. :-)

Twilight said...

WWW ~~~ Oh really? That's interesting. Violet ink....to match her eyes! ;-)

Twilight said...

Rossa ~~~ I hadn't heard about that. Hmmmm. I had a quick nose around a few Google links too, and some readers' comments are pretty disgusting, I have to say.

From what I can tell most people who support this are afraid that new gun laws will limit their ability to "bear arms", and want their state to be able to over-rule any new federal law they don't like. That's if I've understood it correctly - also, in case the federal govt. does something they don't like in other areas - and as some of those states are Republican led, they will likely not like President Obama's stances on a lot of issues.

I'd have more respect for these people if I hadn't, in two different places, seen the word "assassination' used in comments. These people are just dreadful - no other word to describe them.

Hysteria is rising, I fear.

I don't think what goes on here would apply to the EU, Rossa. to be honest, I think folks over there have more sense (on the whole - they have learned lessons from WW2).

anthonynorth said...

I get this all the time in criticism of my paranormal research - give them half an understanding and they have four times the 'knowledge'.

Shawn Carson said...

Nice detective work by you, Twilight! Dude couldn't even get his own birthday right! From looking at the photos, I've noticed a few other differences between these 2 also, if you know what I mean. That Liz Taylor, smokin' hot, back in the day!

As for the thread about states rights...I ran across a gun dealer the other day who told me that sales have spiked higher than ever and manufacturers can't keep up with demand right now. Are we on the verge of a real blood and guts revolution?

Rossa said...

Well I hope I don't burst the bubble for you but there are reports from within the military (leaks) that not only has the MOD ordered large quantites of tear gas and other riot gear but has also been checking if the Army would be prepared to shoot UK citizens in the event of riots in the summer!

If the Army turns against the population Anarchy won't be far away. It is far too easy these days for a member of the public to buy illegal weapons via the internet and the black market. As there are far more of us than them what with the number of our boys in Iraq and Afghanistan, then any protest/riot could turn ugly.

I really hope it doesn't come to that but protests have already started here over jobs for foreign workers. Not helped by the ONS issuing figures showing that 1 in 9 people has been born abroad. And more foreign workers being brought in to build the Olympic site.

These are just the sorts of things the BNP loves to use to support their racist viewpoints which could increase their chances at the EU elections. So the same mindset seems to at work here too.

Twilight said...

AN ~~~ Ain't that the truth! :-)

Twilight said...

Shawn ~~~ She was lovely, yes! him - not so much. ;-D

Re states' rights - I was quite disturbed by some of the stuff I read yesterday, and it's odd that it hasn't been covered more by proper news outlets. Either the authorities are worried, or the people making noise on-line are just blowing hot air, having seen too many action movies and video games!

It appears that our state, Oklahoma, is one of the leaders in trying for state sovereignty. However, I looked on a left-wing site to see what they were saying, and a couple of lawyer types had commented that it's all hot air, token protests because they lost the election - been done before and will come to naught when it reaches the Supreme Court, because 10th Amendment rights have been defined already and these claims are always ditched.

Anyway, it's best be be aware, I guess. ;-(

Twilight said...

Rossa~~~ Well, I'm out of touch aren't I? Living in a dream world about the UK perhaps. :-)

The internet does tend to dramatise stuff a lot, though. Before the election here last year there were all kinds of stories going around, none of which came to anything. It seems as though people have dull lives and try to get some excitement going on-line.

Still, we have to bear in mind the story of the boy who cried "Wolf!" We'd best watch developments on both sides of the pond.

Rossa said...

I agree about the amount of stories in the Media which can skew things.

My own guess is that this may be a bit of reverse psychology. i.e. the media claims there are going to be riots in the summer, the MOD "leaks" that they are ready with equipment and guns and what do you know everyone stays home to watch Wimbledon....lol

Mind you we did have the fuel protests a couple of years ago to try and get the govt to reduce fuel duty. Had some success in blocking the fuel depots and was organised via the internet. A bit like the "yoof" do when organising an illegal rave...publish details on Facebook and hope to outwit the Police. Nowadays it's probably Twitter(ed), sorry I think that's tweeted...not up to speed with these modern comms.

I suppose living on the outskirts of Bradford and Keighley I could be right in the middle of it...let's hope it is just Media hot air.

Twilight said...

Rossa ~~~ Let's hope that it IS reverse psychology at work in the UK.

Today's communication technologies often seem to have gone "a bridge too far" for comfort. There's a definite downside !

anthonynorth said...

A quick point on Army plans in case of riot. As ex-military myself, the forces always plan for every possibility, no matter how extreme, and prepares accordingly. The government would be incompetent if such plans were not made. But there is a big difference between sensible planning to make sure the unexpected is expected, and actually carrying out those plans.

Twilight said...

Thanks for pointing that out, AN.
I guess it's the same this side of the Atlantic too.

Jacqueline Bigar said...

I see you are hearing a lot on this.
When I lived in Philadelphia,one night through a friend, I met his 'best" friend. John was born same day, same time as me only he was born in Scranton where as I was born in Washington DC.
We immediately liked each others being such narcissists.(LOL)..we were brutally blunt with each other, understood each other, had the same friends, both had black humor laughing ourselves into tears When I discover we actually has same birthday , time and year....I kept track of JOHN even more.

John was a judge,.He had several marriages, and really never was happy. Nor was I. I had married young , had 2 children and a good relationship with my x. We had chosen the same circle of friends...which interested me, but what baffled me as an astrologer was when he had highs, I was on a bummer transit. We demonstrated the highs and lows of a transit.
He dies about 8 years ago, ( I was thrilled to still be alive when i heard the sad news)slipped on ice. At that point in his life,he was finally happy. I still wonder about our association..

Twilight said...

Jacquie ~~ Thanks for adding some real life information of your own to the topic. It's interesting that you would bond, without knowing you were almost astro-twins, and that transits were identifiable for both but in different ways.

I've never known an exact astro twin personally. I have a cousin, born 3 days before me on the same general area, whose life has followed a fairly similar pattern to my own, but personality-wise and interest-wise we're not much alike.